New to Skeet
Mount and Gun FitNote that in the following video's the gun was proved safe before the filming started, and this was done in a safe environment. Always be sure your gun is unloaded and safe before handling it.
Length of PullQuestion:
Allen when I use the ruler method typically my guns are nearly 3/4 inch longer than that rule method. I do really push the gun into my shoulder which must help some. I have known it for some time but your video got me to thinking. I also use trap pads with one of Henry's adjusters. Bumpbusters are used.
What are your experiences with someone like me who is shooting LOP a little longer than the ruler method?
My method is a good place to start and is usually very close, but there are always exceptions. The trap pad and bumpbuster could make some difference, I am not sure that much though. What I see when the gun is too long is, the shooter has a hard time getting the gun mounted high enough, which leads to having to push your head down to the gun, which leads to picking your head up. The other thing I see when the LOP is too long is, as the shooter rotates and pushes the gun up to the target, it causes the shooter to push the gun away from their face. This is what I have seen, but doesn't mean this is the case with you.
You just need to ask yourself, are these things that I am doing?
Good Luck Allen aka wam
Recoil Pad PositionQuestion:
On your video on gun mount, just exactly where is the recoil pad in the shoulder pocket? I used to have it sort of in the center of my pocket. Since I have made these comb changes, I have been trying, actually purposely, mounting the gun a little higher. I think I read on SGW that someone mentioned the pad should be even with the collarbone or top of the shoulder.
Where the recoil pad goes depends a lot on how much drop at the heel and cast the stock has.
If the gun has a adjustable butt pate, you can move it to where it needs to be when you have the gun mounted so that your eyes are centered and your eye rib relationship is right.
In other words keeping your head up and not having to push your head down to the gun.
To just say, put the recoil pad even with or above the collarbone is a misleading statement.
For example, if the gun has 4” of drop at the heel and you mount it 1” above the collarbone, the comb could be higher than your eye or where you cannot put your head on the gun.
It is always best IMO to use the face to establish where the gun goes in the pocket, then move the pad to where it needs to be for comfort.
Hope this helps,
Allen aka wam
Forend Hand PlacementQuestion:
Could you elaborate on this comment you made on Shotgun World
"I saw something that reinforced what I knew today, that is where you hold the forend really has a lot to do with controlling the gun and how you rotate."
What position on the forend allows best control and rotation? Thanks in advance for the insight.
It is my belief that a hold farther out yields the best control. If you think about it in this way, if your forend hand is back close to the receiver and you move it up say a inch, the end of the gun goes up 3 or 4 times as much, the farther out you get it the less the multiplier is. So a small move when the hand is out farer doesn't effect things as much. Also it is harder to push the gun away from your face with your hand out farther. This also seems to promote a better rotation. If you look at LP's gun and mine along with others, we all have a extra long forend, for this reason.
This is just my opinion and I am sure that others will say different. Hope I answered your question.
Allen aka wam
I am in my late seventies and pushing eighty, but in excellent physical condition. I shot skeet for a brief period of time in the eighties, even took some lessons from the late Ed Scheer. my shotgun , at the time was a Bretta 686 with full set of Kolar tubes. Three years ago, started to shoot skeet again, and purchased a super skeet K-80 with full set of Kolar tubes.
Gil Ash told me that the shotgun(K-80) had a high stock and high rib, and I will be shooting high. He recommended a number 3 stock.
I took the K-80 to Champlin Arms, had a thinner recoil pad installed, and bent the stock. I patterned the k-80 with the LM choke on the lower barbell and Skeet on the upper ( not from the rest).
Unless I press my face into the stock, the pattern registers high.
I, am not doing well with either of the two guns, although slightly better with the Bretta. My problem is high 2 and low six and on occasion high one. I do not float the low 3,4,5 .
I have been told numerous times that I shot above number one and two high.
I do not believe that my poor performance is because of Gun Fit, for indeed the Bretta fits perfect. I wonder if the high rib blocks my right eye, and I am shooting with left eye. Or cross eyes dominant ?
I have to close my left eye to hit the one low with both shotguns.
Do I benefit from an IC choke on the lower Barrel do you have any suggestion for me .
I am and will remain grateful for the kind consideration of me .
I apologize in advance for imposition on your time.
First, you should have your face tight on the gun. It sounds like you could be cross dominate, which can be cured with a eye patch (occluder), see my website on how to put one on in the right place.
Also you can change the front barrel hanger on the K-80 to lower the point on impact on the bottom barrel and the top barrel shouldn’t matter that much ,if you single load for singles, because the 2nd shot on single doubles is a close shot anyway. And no I don’t think an ic choke will help, but it depends on many things, like shells, where you break the targets and etc.
I hope this helps and feel free to ask questions anytime.
Allen aka WAM
Bead Alignment Shifting during shotQuestion:
Hey Allen, I have a question I've been meaning to ask for awhile. After a shot, I like to hold my mount and see if the beads are still lined up. That is to see if the gun is moving at all in reference to my body. On fast left-to-right shots, like H2 and H3, I find the beads aren't lined up and the barrel is pointing a little to the right of center. For the same shots going the other way, L5 and L6, everything is straight when I finish the shot.
What do you think this is, a fit issue or maybe a forward hand movement?
Thanks in advance,
If I remember right you are right handed. I would say this is common with right handed shooters, but not really what you want. You always want to finish like you started.
The reason you notice it on these fast shots is gun speed. The momentum carries the gun away from your face. This is really easy to cure most of the time, if you are not pushing the gun with your left arm. Even if you are, this will cure it most of the time. That is turn your feet more to the right, another thing is to hold out a little more and make a less aggressive move to the target. One other thing is length of pull, if the gun is too long it can cause some of this. Also you can move your left hand farther out on the forend, which helps control the gun more and limits the amount you can push the gun with your arm. I am sure if I could watch you shoot I could tell just what you need to do. You could do a video with your phone of these shots and email it to me and then I could give you a more precise answer.
Allen aka WAM